Thank you to to good folks at ALI-CLE's The Practical Lawyer, for putting me together with Rajiv Khanna, and memorializing our recent conversation in this piece to be published in next month's issue: "Conversation With a Colleague: Robert Thomas," The Practical Lawyer (ALI-CLE June 2023).
Rajiv and I chatted about property law (including the Rule Against Perpetuities, even!), the difference between public interest lawyering and private practice, online vs in-person, a national practice vs a local practice, pathways to professional contentment, and considering yourself as a general practitioner in the age of legal specialization:
You still consider yourself to be a general practitioner. You have focused on property in private practice. You teach property in law school, and you also are doing public interest litigation. Out of all of these careers, what do you think you find the most satisfying?That is truly a tough question. I loved private practice. I loved being able to help people solve their problems. I liked both large and small cases, cases that were money makers. Unfortunately, there were a lot of cases that were not money-makers but I still treasure the associations I have with those clients or cases where we couldn’t win. I love the people I worked with. I remain friends with them to this day.I also love teaching law because you’re not bound by what the client can afford. Should I be looking at that issue? How about that side issue? Can I go there? In the academic world, that is actually encouraged. And secondly, I love working with soon-to-be lawyers and watching as the lights turn on in their eyes and they open their minds to the possibilities. A lot of them, I think, were like I was in law school and thinking, “This class on land use is at a good place and fits in my schedule.” And then they find out that property is not a static subject. It’s right on the cutting edge of things, and they really enjoy it.And then the last two years I’ve been a lawyer with the nonprofit Pacific Legal Foundation and I really am enamored of that. In private practice, there were a few days here and there when you have to get your bills out or you have to call a client who’s late in paying, or you have to get into a fight with the other side. And you think, when is this day going to end? But I have yet to have any of those days at PLF. I wake up every day eager to get back to work. It’s a great freedom being able to tell clients, don’t worry, we will cover all of your legal fees and all of the costs. We’re here to help you, and to help shape the law to benefit everyone. When you can tell clients that, they view you as someone who is coming in solely to help them, as opposed to someone coming in to help them and maybe make some money. It really changes the dynamic of the relationship. The colleagues that I work with are the best and the brightest in our field—really dynamite advocates—so I feel incredibly lucky to have come into this position.But if I had to choose between private practice, teaching, and public interest law, I think I have to go with public interest practice. Just because there hasn't been a day yet that I haven't thought, Today is going to be fun. I’m going to learn some stuff. I don't have to worry about billable hours. I don›t have to worry about chasing clients for overdue invoices. I don’t really have to worry too much about the drudgery of litigation. I’ve also somehow avoided many of the big drawbacks that you might hear about in typical civil litigation. I don’t know whether that’s because I’m dealing with mostly government lawyers on the other side who are very professional. It would pain me to have to let go of my academic and scholarly work, but if I had to, I would choose public interest law. It’s fantastic.
Check it out if you are inclined, and don't mind TMI.
Conversation With a Colleague: Robert Thomas, The Practical Lawyer (ALI-CLE June 2023)
